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Chemosabe SwampGas wannabee (107.72.162.53) on 10/22/2014 - 6:29 p.m. says: ( 150 views , 6 likes )

"Maybe I don't understand atheism but I also"

Message Replied To ==========

You have a fundamental misunderstanding of atheism

Atheism isn't a positive claim. It is a disbelief in gods-- period. No more, no less. I don't even claim to know that there are no gods-- I don't know that and it is impossible to prove a claim like that. I just haven't seen anything to make me believe that they exist. So no, I have no monopoly on truth, but then again I am not making extraordinary claims here-- claims of a substantial power existing that we cannot see, a creator lurking behind everything and looming over all of our actions. These are your claims; claims for which some evidence should be supplied-- or at the very least logical consistency if we are to consider them for our worldview.

It sounds like your life was terrible without faith. I hate that for you, but it is not my life nor that of any of the atheists I know. We don't miss "that which is beyond" because we don't think it's there, and we generally appreciate that which is right in front of us all the more as a result. This life is the only one we have. I enjoy it. I'm happy. The God hypothesis is not helpful for me in the way it's obviously helpful for you.

I don't think theists lack logic or intellect, though I do they they can be prone to suspend the use of them. I know a great many who are incredibly bright, including my childhood hero-- my grandfather, one of the most devout men I know. I wanted to be just like him when I grew up-- knowledgeable about many things, loving, kind, fun, athletic, strong. It turns out I don't have this cavity that he filled with his faith, though. I have no need for it, and that's a very good thing-- because I couldn't fill it with any religion I've heard of to this point.

I know you don't buy my arguments. There's a wall in the way. You're not going to buy them no matter how much logical sense they make. You come to the wall and suspend the criticality that you use in your job every day-- this is how I see it. I don't know why you do this because I can't step to the other side of that wall. You could also argue that the wall is mine, blocking me from faith. That works too, because that's not a wall I can scale-- it's a wall that is inconsistent logically, damaging historically, and of no interest to me personally except as a curiosity about human nature.==============================

Am not always trying to knock atheists every chance I get. I DO know that you and Jean Vol Jean (An aside here: why choose one of the most iconic pro-Christian figures in literature as an icon?) clearly do not understand faith. You claim we have a "wall" in reasoning that allows us to suspend logic. We see you as having limited yourselves to only the concrete and trying to hold religion up to a higher standard of proof than your own beliefs.science alone tells us there is much more than the Universe we can sense perceive around us. There are other universes and things our limited mortal minds will never comprehend, yet even Science claims they exist .

Trying to explain faith to you is like trying to explain music to a deaf man. We can discuss the concrete aspects such as the vibratory rates that make up the notes and the mathematics of chords and progressions, but unless you can actually HEAR it then terms like "de crescendo" are just meaningless "flowery" words to you. What you and many atheists bring up as arguments FOR atheism don't make logical sense to us because the arguments are limited to small, trivial things that don't matter much. Analogous to arguing why a classical guitarist used an open fingering instead of a bar...

I did not realize how empty my life was before faith ...that is my point. It wasn't 't until after I was blessed by it that I realized how much richer life is WITH it.

I hope someday you can appreciate the symphony.

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